WTF Podcast

Episode 479 - Lena Dunham

“People expect me to either defend or explain my generation but, because I feel 75 inside myself, I’m not really the right candidate for the job.” That’s what Girls creator Lena Dunham tells Marc when she visits the garage. Instead of carrying the burdens of an entire generation, Lena and Marc talk about modern art, feminism, filmmaking, dating and a morbid fascination with death. This episode is sponsored by PillPack, Sirens on USA Network, and LegalZoom.


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Stuart March 17, 2014 at 5:16 am

As a left-wing Liberal, a Canadian, and an atheist, nobody has ever accused me of being conservative. After listening to that interview, I felt conservative. Worse, I felt a strong desire to be even more conservative. For the first time in my life I understand why American conservatives despise Liberals so much. The amount of elitist, precious and self-congratulatory rhetoric emanating from my laptop made me want to vomit. Unlike Lena, I don’t vomit very often.

Tad Daniels March 17, 2014 at 5:54 am

Lena Dunham has the perfect body for radio.

Jen Salz March 17, 2014 at 6:00 am

Lena Dunham was fine.  Nice cleanse from Annabelle Gurwith.  Every podacst after AG will seem that way for a long time.

Sorta Totally March 17, 2014 at 7:03 am

Fuck, Marc, Camrys are made to last 20 years if you follow the maintenance schedule. That’s why you buy them. Just run the best tires (peek at what comes on the new ones, Toyota has track-tested current makes), and replace the strut cartidges at 100k and it drives exactly like a new one.
~ You don’t need to bias the circuitry if you match the tube exactly, unless you’re one of those guys that wants (or claims he can hear) that extra 1%. There’s lots of golden ear fallacy out there. The cost is probably extreme, right? Given an a/b test, you’d probably prefer the cost/sound of solid state. </unsolicited advice>
~ Marc, I gotta mention Bob Newhart again…
~ Lena, it’s not your job to represent all women anyway. Ignore the haters that foist the role of flashpoint ad hominem. There will be time to analyze cultural impacts in retrospect. 1630 called; Rubens (my distant relative) wants to capture you.

Jim T. March 17, 2014 at 7:25 am

Hi, Lena Dunham.

I did the math for you on your clock dream. If our lives happened in a day, assuming that you get to be the average lifespan of an American woman (82.2), you’re only at about 8:10 AM! Isn’t that great? At noon, you’d be halfway through your average lifespan (that statement is not a judgement on you or your work—in fact I think assuming you’re going to be 82.2 is awesome) and only 41.

If you’re only counting the hours you’re awake as the day, let’s assume in this hypothetical day that you wake up at 7 AM and stay up until midnight: you would be roughly 12:45 PM right now.

Marc, you’re 3:30 PM, and 5:20 PM assuming that you’re only counting waking hours. (Average US male lifespan is 77.4.)

This was fun. I liked the podcast.

Alec March 17, 2014 at 10:14 am

Ugh, what a singularly unattractive thing Lena is. She literally looks like an ugly man with absolutely NO feminine aspects to her. And a face like master blaster in thunder dome. As for her personality? I had wonder if WTF had jumped the shark. Listening to lena was like going hs and asking 15 yr old questions. In other words they think they know everything, but lack the experience wit or judgment to say anything worth a damn.

Pam March 17, 2014 at 10:48 am

What a great way to start the week!  Love Lena, love Marc, loved the show!  She is beautiful~inside and out. She gives me hope for the future of women in our society and, by association, for the men who will need them as soul mates.  Lena, you are a golden, juicy pear in the fruit basket of life!  Dress yourself up in cellophane and tie a bow around your gloriousness!!  <3<3<3

Kris Y March 17, 2014 at 11:23 am

‘Woody Allen hasn’t made a good movie in a long time’
-Lena Dunham

Yasmin March 17, 2014 at 11:26 am

Why does everything Lena ever engages with have to be recieved first by people who pick apart her appearance and ignore everything else she says? You’re holding her to a standard that you hold virtually NONE of Marc’s other guests to. And when you do, again, it’s women. It’s really disheartening to see these comments. If you don’t like her personality, fine, but the incessant need to fault her appearance just reminds me of how frequently Marc’s female guests have their worth equated to their looks, and how shitty it feels as a woman to constantly read those remarks. Go back to the episodes interviewing men and count how many times someone relates how funny they are to how attractive they’re perceived.

Personally, I find Lena really cute, articulate and inspiring. I really liked listening to this episode! She’s clearly an intelligent person and has tapped into a very clever way to voice seemingly trivial things of her generation in significant ways.
Marc, please don’t let this backlash stop you from interviewing more women! Think of Pamela Adelon, Chelsea Peretti, Sarah Silervman. It’s SO nice to hear interviews with women like these who can change people’s ideas of women in comedy and how they can be funny despite or inspite of how people think they look.

Eric Skammelig March 17, 2014 at 11:30 am

Excellent, good move Marc.  This had to happen.  Girls is one of the best shows out there right now.

Jim T: great post.

DM (Not Depeche Mode) March 17, 2014 at 11:54 am

Most of you WTF comments are deeply depressing me, I thought people who’d listen to Maron would be less ignorant and hateful.

Bumper March 17, 2014 at 11:56 am

Moon: “Look at the household I grew up in.”
I love that so much.

Guest March 17, 2014 at 12:06 pm

The whole thing reminds me of what Molly Ivins said about Bush: He was born on third base, and thinks he hit a triple.

Robyn March 17, 2014 at 12:16 pm

So psyched for this!!!!

DM (Not Depeche Mode) March 17, 2014 at 12:29 pm

And as a someone who is only a few years younger than Lena (and it’s scaring me that I won’t have my own HBO show in four-five years…) I agree that we are self-indulgent and overly opinionated and prone to clinging to ideological constructs (political and sexual), because we are 20 year-olds. We are still children like all of the 20 year-olds preceding us. All ageism aside, this was a delightful interview Marc and Dunham is a sugary jolt of energy to a generally dreary Monday.

KZ March 17, 2014 at 12:57 pm

Fun interview. Lena Dunham is great, so mature and intelligent. It was refreshing listening to someone as self-possessed. Who gives a damn if she makes insecure men uncomfortable.

Pierre March 17, 2014 at 1:31 pm

“Reckon with it” is my new catchphrase.

Thanks, Marc.

AEdouard March 17, 2014 at 2:32 pm

What the hell is wrong with you people?

Sure, I’d like Lena’s millions, but she sure gets a beating for reasons I find pretty hard to understand. Take it easy people, she’s not Pol Pot!

Marvydoo March 17, 2014 at 2:55 pm

I think it’s sad that people attack Lena for her body positivity.

I guess my beef is that it’s tough for me to swallow aggression from a limousine feminist.  She’s the nicest person in interviews, which results in a strangely mirrored Woody Allen scenario, where I think she seems like a thoughtful, respectful person in real life but her works are so often egregiously offensive to my sensibilities.  Meanwhile, I’m ill-inclined to challenge my sensibilities if her position is generational.  If she’s adapted her parents’ Manhattan Art Society sensibilities, why am I to question my midwestern sensibilities that tell me that what I’m watching is an affront?

She seems like a nice person in interviews.  I guess I put her in some sort of nebula with Bret Easton Ellis, whatever that means.

Jay March 17, 2014 at 3:03 pm

Perversely, the ignorant misogynists who zero in on Lena Dunham only serve to validate everything she’s saying. Her work stands on its own, but the attacks elevate the importance of her voice in this culture.

About Woody Allen, no, we can’t use past works of fiction to convict him of a real crime, but knowing what we know now makes it impossible to watch his films in the same way. Manhattan is much creepier than it was 35 years ago.

Rachel March 17, 2014 at 5:01 pm

This was so lovely. It was nice hearing topics that aren’t always covered on this show, especially in a discussion between two wonderful people. This made my monday!

Clare March 17, 2014 at 5:43 pm

Could not have been more excited than when I woke up this morning and saw that Lena Dunham was today’s podcast—even skipped Marc’s personal update which grows longer every week (sorry, dude). Dunham is a grounded visionary: thoughtful, articulate, and brilliantly subversive in the best possible way. Dunham “owns” herself—her views, her insecurities, her strengths, her body, her biases. She has got to be one of the most self-possessed people in her industry. Love that she self-identifies as a feminist—and understands that this is an empowering thing, not a pigeon-holing label. It was also cool that she was so familiar with WTF.

To the people who are criticizing her appearance—the joke’s on you. You embody what she is subverting with her art. Society hopes that someday you’ll get it, but Many more women look like Dunham than like [insert latest “hot” starlet here]. Our collective vision of ideal beauty is shaped by Hollywood, the media, and the now commonplace ubiquity of Internet porn.

And whatever commenter mentioned Bob Newhart—brilliant idea! An interview with him would make an awesome podcast. His show was almost like a proto-Seinfeld.

Rudy March 17, 2014 at 7:21 pm

So excited to hear Lena coming to Palm Springs!

gc March 17, 2014 at 7:54 pm

LOVED this interview and I love the comments that call out the Lena-haters even more.

LifeTraumatic March 17, 2014 at 8:08 pm

Dude. I thought Moon sent you a Play-Doh quote. Not Plato. Now I feel dumb…

GUEST March 17, 2014 at 9:05 pm

That Plato quote was inspiration for the song “The Origin of Love” from Hedwig and the Angry Inch, starring John Cameron Mitchell, who had a funny recurring role on GIRLS.

Great Interview.  Lena Dunham is fantastic.

Jas March 17, 2014 at 9:13 pm

Reading some of these comments is making me feel ill. Why would you come to a place where interesting, thoughtful discussions take place and make horrible comments about a person’s appearance. There have been plently of men on this podcast who are far from an ideal but I don’t remember a single comment being made on that. Why? Maybe because many people still believe that a women’s instrinsic value lies in her appearance. And I think Lena is a beautiful woman anyway! Grow up and try and understand why you have so much hatred.

Serge March 17, 2014 at 10:49 pm

She seems like a perfectly nice young girl, but she has no business pretending that she knows about anything outside of her sheltered bubble.  It’s shameful to listen to someone who knows something of life defer so conspicuously to someone who plainly does not.

I wish Mark had been aware of the type of paintings her father does.  He does these huge works that are closeups of a woman’s pussy and asshole.  I use crude language to describe them because they are crude; look it up. Growing up as she did, it is hardly surprising that Lena has some unusual tendencies.

Zipdisk March 18, 2014 at 12:06 am

all the name calling and vitriol is coming from the Lena defenders… don’t strain a muscle patting yourselves on the back. sheesh.

Remus March 18, 2014 at 12:54 am

Girls is not my cup of tea (especially this season), but Lena Dunham is clearly an intelligent and talented young woman.  There is an insane amount of misogyny here, and most of it, it seems to me, stems from the ridiculous belief that she should apologize for who she is:

That she should apologize for being the daughter of two successful New York artists;
That she should apologize for her talent and obvious intelligence;
That she should apologize for her self-awareness and self-confidence;
And, most of all, that she should apologize for her body type.

Seriously, some of you guys really sound like those dumb-ass dudes who just love to see tits and ass in public, but who get freaked out and even furious whenever a woman breast-feeds on a park bench.

Zipdisk March 18, 2014 at 1:00 am

thanks for strengthening my point, Remus.

Remus March 18, 2014 at 1:07 am

I didn’t strengthen your point, Zipdisk, as there was neither vitriol nor name-calling in my post.  Having said that, I do love your handle: It perfectly encapsulates your adorable irrelevance!

TREVOR March 18, 2014 at 1:42 am

I literally have sex

AnnaW March 18, 2014 at 2:05 am

Jas is right. There is next to nothing when it comes to comments on male guest’s looks. People pay attention to what they say, how they think, the essence of their character. I relate to what Lena says about not wanting to be the downer at the party. I’ve laughed along with jokes that hurt for the sake of “being cool”. I’m only in my thirties and I’m already less visible in the world. She’s a damn good writer, and she’s a thoughtful, articulate person. Even if you don’t like anything about her work, why is it okay to throw in a personal insult about her body? Because women’s value in our culture has more to with their looks than it does for men. And she’s beautiful. That’s the sickest f***ing part. I admire the hell out of her for being herself, unapologetically, and for having this kind of poise in her twenties. It inspires me. I could tell you enjoyed talking with her Marc, and it was fun to hear. Thanks for the show. All of ‘em.

Joey March 18, 2014 at 4:29 am

I love The Symposium so much, Marc. Really happy to hear you reading from it during your intro.

Bridget March 18, 2014 at 5:56 am

Awful.  Just awful.  Agenda’s aren’t appropriate for this podcast.  Not even feminist ones.  I come here to get AWAY from that crap.

It’s sad that a self-absorbed human gets a pass because she says all the right things the grrrrls want to hear.  I am a woman who doesn’t need to play the victim.

Me, me, me, me, me….......................................huh Lena?

Doug March 18, 2014 at 6:21 am


Ridiculous to attack a woman on her looks.  And shallow.

There’s plenty to dislike about Lena without bringing her looks into it.  And her Dad’s “art” is more disturbing than anything she thinks Woody Allen ever did.

Watched Tiny Furniture with a woman who thought it was shallow, self-absorbed, and trite.

I agreed.

Marc, I hope you’re not letting girlfriends pick the guests?

Finn March 18, 2014 at 7:18 am

Geeze, who listens to an interview show and complains that the guest was self-absorbed? Or watches a movie made by a 20-year old and complains that it’s trite? Reckon with it, folks!

Thanks Marc and Lena for an engaging meeting of minds. I’ve never seen Girls but now I want to check it out.

Ben March 18, 2014 at 7:33 am

“And her Dad’s “art” is more disturbing than anything she thinks Woody Allen ever did.”

Her dad’s paintings aren’t disturbing. They are hilarious.

Scott March 18, 2014 at 8:52 am

If I were Mr. Maron I’d remove the troll comments.  It seems to me that many of these vile comments against Lena Dunham are being made by the same person.

Please don’t engage them.  They write those things to read the reactions and laugh AT YOU.

Another fantastic interview.

jamie March 18, 2014 at 10:21 am

the poisonous shit posted in these comments is embarrassing.,you should be truely ashamed
of youselves you bellends

Tom March 18, 2014 at 1:26 pm

I am not a Lena Dunham fan and I think Girls is a horrible show. I understand that I’m probably not the target demo for her work and that she’s probably ok with that. I decided to not skip this one because I love Marc and I thought I owed it to those I know who enjoy her to give it a good faith listen.
But what disappointed me with this interview was that there was barely any exploration of her professional history. The thing I like about WTF is that Marc takes apart creative peoples’ resumes in way that we get a good picture of who they are and how they got to where they they are in their chosen field. (Think of Seth Green for example, since he’s close-ish in age to her. Marc went nearly line by line down his early work and how he got into the business.)
I learned nothing about Lena. Except that she does seem like a pleasant person and is thoughtful about gender and race. Aside from that she doesn’t seem to have much humor or charisma. Oh she seems to really enjoy Twitter.
How was she able to make her first movie? How did she meet Judd Apatow? How did she land a deal with HBO? These are the things I would like to know because she and her career is truly baffling to me.
She alluded to privilege when she mentioned Gawker, but she didn’t do anything to me to dispel that narrative. Because of that, I am left with the same opinion of her as when I started: that she owes her career to her parents and money rather than hard work or any innate talent.

john March 18, 2014 at 2:04 pm

I really enjoy Lena Dunham and her work, and I will eagerly watch/read/listen to whatever she does going forward. Her stuff is sharp, funny, touching, honest and pure. I also enjoy hearing what she has to say in interviews. I like her.

And I also understand she is personal friends with the Farrows and the Farrow’s circle of friends (and business & political associates) and how she would naturally feel about Woody Allen. I get it. I really do. I do not doubt her sincerity AT ALL..

That said, she should stop talking about Woody Allen. I write this without claiming to know what the Farrows say about him is true or not. Nor do I offer an opinion about it. I just feel that her using her celebrity in media forums, such as this one, as an opportunity to go after her friend’s ex is not okay.
Pushing this subject/agenda in media outlets has only one purpose: to cause harm.
Please stop.

Linda March 18, 2014 at 2:33 pm

I liked the interview. To hear Andrea Dworkin brought up by a fifty year old MAN to a 27 year old women was awesome.

I think it is great that young women like Lena Dunham are stilling using the word “feminist”. We haven’t come very far in the last two decades. Some of the women in my generation seemed to think feminism was liking what guy’s like or becoming more like a guy. “All my friends are guys!” So tired of the Pussy Cat Doll Feminism or Suicide Girl Feminism. I was ten years too young for Sex and the City, which was like feminism according to the gay man. And now ten years too old for Girls but it is really nice to see the work of a thoughtful and bold young women with an education go so mainstream.

I haven’t really seen anyone nail it quite yet, why people are so provoked by Dunham’s nudity. I think a certain kind of man get enraged by a certain kind of woman. One subtle example of this presented itself when I was watching Graham Norton Show on Sarah Silverman and Mark Wahlberg. If you are ever bored one day, check it out. A smart, confident, unapologetic woman getting far too much attention for Mr. Big Stuff. The fact that Sarah Silverman has a macho way about her and tends towards the perverse also seems to give permission to this type of guy to get especially nasty. I think it is much the same dynamic. These people want to grind into the ground any power exhibited by a woman that falls out of the parameters defined by men.

I think it is less about Dunham’s looks and more about her power as a woman. And exhibit A is the fact that Lena is quite attractive and she looks really good naked, even better than in clothes and not a lot of people can say that.

Stuart March 18, 2014 at 2:36 pm

There were over three times as many criticisms of Dunham-bashers than actual criticisms of Dunham. Dunham critics were almost invariably referred to as mysoginist which is utter garbage in my case and probably in others. What bothers me, is that Dunham, the walking embodiment of Liberal pretension, sounds off on life and its ills like she knows what she’s talking about. Most importantly, she has a public forum to spew her New York, elitist, self-indulgence to a generation of women who will rarely have enough money or talent to see her kind of problems. She gets criticized by regular people, but she’s the darling of the New York media because they’ve all had similar priveliged upbringings and can’t see her pretension past their own. People criticise her nudity and her body, not because she’s unattractive, but because they see her high-minded, art house pretense, despise it, and want to throw it back in her face. I think women are missing the point behind Dunham-bashers. It’s not her feminism they’re criticizing, it’s her elitism.

Anderson March 18, 2014 at 3:19 pm

Lena Dunham is the poster child for nepotism. Doesn’t matter whether she’s a boy, girl or transgender. People can’t stand her because she’s a spoiled white girl that had every opportunity handed to her.

Also, woman of color are so much damn sexier than this white hefer. To hell with white women and their dumb fuckin’ problems.

h March 18, 2014 at 3:47 pm

Great interview, interesting nice girl.

awhatthefucknik March 18, 2014 at 4:12 pm

I really enjoyed listening to this interview! Dunham deploys some unexpected, delightful turns of phrase that bespeak a spunky character and an intelligent mind at work (and that make for a fun, funny exchange between Dunham and Maron). While I am rather disheartened by a number of the comments in this forum that I read as symptomatic of sexist ideology, I am also encouraged by the number of comments that seek to counter or expose that ideology. There can be no progress without critique.

Vince March 18, 2014 at 4:45 pm

I have a daughter, and if she grows up to question power structures, speak her mind freely, not be ashamed of her body, willing to accept a compliment but also give them freely, dump mean boyfriends, get herself educated as best as possible, show her intelligence instead of hide it, push her talents as far as she can take them, not be afraid of a fight but not be beholden to them either, all by age 27,  then I would be as proud of her as I am sure Mr. Dunham is of his daughter. And if I have to take a bunch of pictures of ladies assholes to do it, then so be it.

Luke March 18, 2014 at 6:32 pm

Have to agree, all the guys on here dismissing her because of her looks come across as creepy douchebags. Go back to 1940’s Kazakhstan.

Nobunaga73 March 18, 2014 at 7:56 pm

I really enjoyed this interview, great conversation. I admire Lena Dunham a lot - it’s astounding the amount of abuse she has to deal with and she shows an amazing strength of character staying focused on what she wants to create. I can understand not liking her show, but the vitriol behind some of these attacks - very depressing. Is there anything sadder than these men who pile onto internet message boards to hurl abuse at women?

Paul Keenan March 18, 2014 at 8:41 pm

I love GIRLS. Lena Dunham is the greatest. Now, you gotta interview Zosia Mamet (plays Shoshonna on GIRLS) daughter of David Mamet.

Mark Duwe March 18, 2014 at 9:32 pm

Those of you who don;t think Lena is beautiful, save your soul now and gouge out your eyes.

Alex Endy March 18, 2014 at 11:10 pm

Thanks, WTF, for another great show! I’ve never seen Lena Dunham’s work, but I’ll be checking it out on the strength of her apparent brains and charm. Gotta agree with the quibble that a bit more of the signature WTF bio-interview would have been nice. And I kinda wished someone had stepped in and put the kibosh on the inappropriately public, extra-legal condemnations of Woody Allen—as a casual film fan, I’m content to let the courts & history decide.
To the Dunham hater/apologists: outside the Internet, real people sometimes respect and admire professionals that they also sometimes disagree with. People who do this are called “adults.”

Jimmy March 19, 2014 at 6:06 am

So let me get this straight - saying you’d rather not see someone naked, or they have a whiny chirpy voice you’d rather not listen to for an hour, or that they obviously owe their career to family connections - that is hateful misguided misogynistic internet bullying. But saying someone is a straight-up child molester like that was the god’s honest truth, and not just yet another healthy serving of Mia Farrow’s eternal venom and slander - that is A-OK, truth positive, empowering and endearing and brave. Got it.
Props to Maron for getting her to admit she does those nude scenes as a spiteful act of revenge on society. I suspected as much.

Andrew March 19, 2014 at 9:11 am

Easily my favorite WTF to date. That was a straight-up fascinating conversation. Lena was a delight and Marc was even more insightful than usual. I enjoyed every minute of it.

Amador March 19, 2014 at 9:20 am

Pretty interesting conversation.  I very much enjoyed this, and what Lena had to say about social issues and how to approach them as a famous person.  I’m not familiar with her show, but obviously I am aware of some of the controversy that people find with it on a surface level.  Body image stereotypes being broken on a show?  I’m all for it.

nunyafishness March 19, 2014 at 1:10 pm

Just finished listening to the Lena Dunham interview.  She’s a smart, hard-working, capable, talented, intensely curious and accepting woman.  All good things.

But I didn’t hear anything compelling in her story that would make me want to watch “Girls”.  Which is in direct contrast to a number of other artists that have been interviewed on WTF that have made me say, “Whoa.  I need to check that out.” 

Guests like Norm Macdonald, Hannibal Buress, Steve Almond, Sara Benincasa, YACHT, etc, have brought a tremendous amount to the table and made me think about a number of things, and chase down their work.

She strikes me as a bit flat, still.  Obviously there’s more there there because guys like Judd Apatow wouldn’t spend time propping up a losing cause, but I can’t for the life of me see it.  Her language is like that of a first year grad student, so maybe for me she needs to be a bit older.  Then maybe she’ll have something to say that I’d want to hear.

gs white March 19, 2014 at 1:36 pm

loved it!!!  Never watched “Girls” but she was engaging!  Thank you.

Jimmyb March 19, 2014 at 2:01 pm

Count me in the corner of a new Lena Dunham fan.  Didn’t really know much about her prior to this podcast, nor have I watched Girls, but I loved what I heard from her (and Marc), and am now very much paying attention.  Something tells me that Girls is only the beginning of many great things to come from her.

Alan Y. March 19, 2014 at 5:39 pm

I wasn’t sure about this one before I listened. But, wow. Lena Dunham is remarkable. I have tried to watch “Girls”, but haven’t really been able to get into it. Maybe it’s becauase I’m a 50-year-old guy from New Jersey. But I’m going to now give it another shot. Gotta be fair.
I have struggled with the Woody Allen dilemma myself. Hearing her take on separating a person’s work from the person himself opened my brain to the possibility of hold two thoughts in my head at once. Wow! What a concept!!
By the way Marc, the show on the 11th at Trepany House was incredible. Brought along 2 friends who weren’t that familiar with you or your comedy and they left being hugely entertained and are now fans. So your soul wrestling sessions are earning you new fans.
Boomer Lives!

Justin March 19, 2014 at 7:10 pm

I’ve heard this girl on BTW podcast and she was hilarious, clever, smart and I have no doubt she is a pretty lady who’s a talented artist deserving of whatever awards and hopefully paid well for her hit TV show.

I was absolutely DISGUSTED with the creepy-as-***K neo-political-correctness, quasi-feminist garbage, the sickening and demented way she thanks her brainwashers for ‘educating her’ while having it both ways, while everyone involved manipulates victim-status and retarded debts and empowerment.

I’m not even joking when I say THIS marks the mental illness of our society and I never thought it was possible to despise…  what’s a word.. to be so sickened.. ‘revolted’ by left-wing liberalism.
I mean.. like her boyfriend I don’t think I’ve vomited in over a decade but this information about word-policing and being ‘educated’ was actually making me want to puke.. physically felt sick. Knowing our society is now very very sick inside.

William Prescott March 19, 2014 at 7:51 pm

It obvious that she is culturally well versed and smart but I was surprised how young she sounded. All that, 27 being old. 27 is old when you are Lindsy Lohan not Lena Dunham.

I thought she complimented you too much. It was like she was really aware of herself. You seemed excited about the interview in the preamble but it all felt like intellectual small talk.

Your normally so fearless in those conversations. It felt like she was trying to be as politically correct as possible the entire time.

I don’t even want to hear the zing on Joan Rivers. I hate that teasing bullshit. Weeeeak.
I really like Girls. This was kinda laim(not your falt).

I don’t think that it should be a cathartic experiance in every interview. I’m sure by this point there’s a wiered pressure to have those moments on your show for both you and the guest.

You do an amazing job. I really value this man. Thanks. Shows great too.

Anthony March 19, 2014 at 8:02 pm

Yes, anyone who thinks Lena Dunham is insufferable must be a misogynist. Definitely.

Anyone who finds Dunham’s comments about age (“45 is a great age.” and “50 is a great age!”) to be annoyingly condescending coming from a 27 year old is a “hater”.

Anyone that sees the blatant hypocrisy she spews about “8th grade stoners” before launching into long-winded, boring, unfunny stories about her dreams is a bully.

Anyone that recognizes the privileged, entitled tone with Lena is a “troll”.

Take it from a huge Lefty who is married to a strong, beautiful, liberal woman - it is okay to dislike Lena Dunham’s show and persona. It doesn’t make you a bad person.

This interview was helpful to me in one way: It demonstrated what Conservative types dislike so much about “liberals” like myself.

marilyn March 19, 2014 at 11:35 pm

AWESOME!  Now I have to see if I can get “Girls” on Netflix.  I am blown away that a 27 year old is this articulate, intelligent and aware.  Really, really appreciated the Woody Allen piece of the interview.  Gave me some peace regarding my recent viewing of Blue Jasmine and my friends that remain rabid WA fans.  I also appreciated Jay’s comments here regarding the lens through which I now view the occasional WA film.

Jan Eliot March 20, 2014 at 9:18 am

garbage heads and haters… Marc you said it all in the intro for today’s podcast before the interview with Duncan Trussell started ... why must garbage heads and haters bother to spread their shit .... I thought your interview with Lena was interesting , engaging and well worth the listen. Thanks.

Dina March 20, 2014 at 11:57 am

I believe in the investigative reporting of Vanity Fair. This online, quick read about the Allen case has convinced me thoroughly. I also suspected Allen of this heinous act because he MARRIED his adopted daughter, who was only 18 at the time of their public relationship.

Alex March 20, 2014 at 1:04 pm

Too all the women hating, misogynistic Neanderthals out there. All men have mothers, some have wives, sisters and daughters. Would you want some man treating your mother, wife, sister or daughter the way you treat this beautiful woman? We have a responsibility to respect and care for each other.

Your vitriol only educates us as to how miserable you and your life must be and not anything about the one you’re talking about. You just tell how sad you are with every word. Don’t speak if you can’t improve the silence.

Jess March 20, 2014 at 1:06 pm

Loved this episode. I’ve never watched girls but this made me want to.

Mark March 20, 2014 at 2:14 pm

Something that bugged me: Lena described a lesbian at Oberlin (the one wearing a dog collar) who was hitting on her, said she looked like Britney Spears, invited her back to her “safe space” dorm room. Why was the fact this woman was black worthy of mention? Does it make her more threatening in Lena’s eyes?

Yaro March 20, 2014 at 5:29 pm

Hm. They must have removed most of those vile comments Marc mentioned, because all I see is aggression and vitriol thrown towards anyone who didn’t like the interview.

That said, I get the feeling that Lena Dunham is getting a lot of that “young person” applause. Seems that to get free applause (on top of whatever applause you actually deserve) you have to be perceived as particularly old or young or goodlooking by your audience.

Someone above wrote: “I am blown away that a 27 year old is this articulate, intelligent and aware.” - Yeah, please settle down. Just because you apparently know the wrong kind of 27 year olds doesn’t make her Mozart.

Abraham March 20, 2014 at 6:00 pm

The only reason she’s hatin’ on Woody Allen is because even though Woody might have diddled a kid or two, has enough class never to shtup a fat kike like Lena Dunham.

Roadshow March 21, 2014 at 6:40 am

I loved this.
One of the best WTFs.

Dunham was smart, charming, funny and a pleasure to listen to.
That she has achieved so much by the age of 27 defies belief and is an inspiration (to someone like me in my 30s. Eek!) to get moving.

That she has done so while owning, supporting and broadcasting her feminism offers not jsut hope for the future but a glimpse of how things might be.
Any vitriol directed her way is, as Marc said, a projection of the speaker’s own fears.

I love this girl.
Her boyfriend’s a lucky man. She’s one in a million.

Ije March 21, 2014 at 7:55 am

What a delight.  Just a great conversation. I have a new appreciation for Lena Dunham. I might actually watch her show now.

Ashley March 21, 2014 at 8:40 am

Thank you, Marc, for this interview with Lena Dunham.  She is a never-ending topic of conversation, and although I have mixed feelings about her it was refreshing to hear a viewpoint that was neither fawning over her extraordinary talent or completely ripping her to shreds.  She seems to be a rather sweet and also hyper self aware person, and I appreciate her artistic fearlessness.  I also think that she has been handed a ludicrous amount of responsibility (her own show, a memoir, writing for the New Yorker) that would drain a more experienced artist (you can probably attest to that), and it has seriously crippled the quality of her art.  Thank god you don’t watch Girls - there would have been no way for you to approach that interview with an open mind if you had seen the slow slide from charming and witty (although slightly irritating) into cliched and boring that the show has underwent in the past three seasons.
I live in Brooklyn and am a few years older than Lena Dunham, and there has been much “selling out” finger pointing directed at her here.  Partially because haters are gonna hate, but also because Girls is so identified with Brooklyn, and us long term Brooklyn (and Greenpoint) residents are not so thrilled about Sex in the City style Girls landmarks tours traipsing up and down our blocks and into our places of business.  I am the first to join on this grumbling bandwagon, but I have become super uncomfortable with the way this complaining has led to extremely offensive things being said about Lena Dunham herself.  Yes, her show is irritating and more often bad then good, and yes, here in Brooklyn we have the right to take that personally., but that does not give us the right to talk so degradingly about her as a human, and (more importantly) as a woman.  The comments that have been made about her publicly and privately should only be reserved for truly horrible people, and I feel for her that she has been thrust into the spotlight so forcefully. 
I lay blame on a society that decides to crown one (relatively young and inexperienced) person as the voice of their generation, and then forces that person to express their voice in as many ways as modern technology can make possible.  Heavy is the head that wears the crown….although in this case the crown is a Brooklyn DIY princess tiara of antlers. (Ugh)  I hope that fame will lay off Lena Dunham for a few years and she’ ll get to have the life experience and maturity that we all deserve, and then she’ll start making some amazing shit.  In the meantime thank you for reminding me that she’s not that bad after all.

TrollSlayer March 22, 2014 at 1:19 pm

Jesus, judging from the amount of misogyny in the comments on this episode, a lot of sock puppets quit giving hand jobs this week. Get out of the house people.

plala March 22, 2014 at 5:01 pm

I can’t bear to read anymore of these comments. I thought this was a great interview, really enjoyed the whole conversation. I love this season of Girls, it’s hysterically funny. I think maybe I didn’t fully get it in season one and was too filled with a sense of ‘get off my lawn.’

Love ya, Lena.

Steff March 23, 2014 at 10:34 am

Wow. As a long time listener and a first-timer to comment, I’m really blown away by all the hate.
IAlthough, I find Girls not the best show out there, it is interesting and it definitely has something to say.
I agree with Jas: “There have been plently of men on this podcast who are far from an ideal but I don’t remember a single comment being made on [their appearance]. Why? Maybe because many people still believe that a women’s instrinsic value lies in her appearance.”
Lena’s CHARACTER on the show is the only lead woman on TV that I have seen that is larger than a size 6 that does not talk about being on the latest diet, doesn’t hide herself under layers of clothes nor needs to be told that her body is ok. The show evokes a lot of questions and it challenges people’s perceptions about women and their bodies.
Keep it up Lena. You have definitely hit a cord.  And I love what you do Marc. Love it.


JohnnyD March 23, 2014 at 12:36 pm

In Bizarro World, “all the name calling and vitriol is coming from the Lena defenders”.

ML Heath March 23, 2014 at 4:49 pm

Hiya Marc - thanks for the spiritual chat with Duncan Trussell. I actually worked with the husband of LaVey’s daughter on a pirate radio station in SF a few yonks back. He has a cool combo,

Meantime, I have contributed to a chapbook in honor of Lou Reed, out this week. (A copy is in postal avion your way meantime…)

Also was jazzed this week to see a cashier at Amoeba Music SF wearing a BOOMER LIVES teeshirt. Yup, we had a lot to talk about…

look fwd to future WTFness -
all best from here,

Fishsticks March 23, 2014 at 7:55 pm

I enjoyed this episode so much. Thanks for getting this interview, Marc. It was cool to hear more about her. I love her show and am so glad she is out there doing stuff.

Erin S. March 23, 2014 at 9:18 pm

I’m not usually one to comment, but this episode definitely goes in my top 10. Great conversation, great platonic chemistry. As one of Lena Dunham’s peers and only a Facebook friend or two removed in our circles, part of me has always wanted to hate on her achievements (it’s Type A girl jealousy, not real disdain). This totally turned it around for me. She’s unreservedly lovely and deserving of her success. For all who complain and disparage—you can change the channel.

Marc, this episode showcased your best qualities and made me appreciate your work even more. Mazel tov on the recent happiness in your personal life!

Rob March 24, 2014 at 12:18 am

I’ve only seen the first season of her a show, (respectfully, while I thought it was well done, I don’t think “I” am its target demographic) but that said, I can recognize and respect that it is well done and certainly “outside” the “norms” we’ve been force fed by mainstream… So for that, it has my respect…

Hearing this podcast, and learning more about Lena, I have to admit, I was impressed… Certainly seems to be hard working & intelligent lady, wise beyond her years…

I haven’t read all the comments, but heard on a more recent podcast that there’s been some “trollery” happening…. If that’s even a word… And I just though I’d chime in with something positive….

Not that she (Lena) needs to hear unqualified advice from a “civilian” (aka non-celebrity) but F—k all the haters….  You’ve accomplished more then most before 30 then most will in a lifetime… And, if we can also set aside the f—ked up/manufacturerd “standard”
Definition of beauty (skinny, vapid & nearly anorexic) she is also a very attractive young lady with a bright future ahead of her…

So ignore all those haters and smile all the way to the bank!!!

Best wishes…


Justin March 24, 2014 at 12:52 am

Here’s the funniest WTF of them all: 

Take a minute to read all the comments here. Just at a glance and you can see there aren’t that many ‘garbagehead’ comments.
There are about 10 (at worst) that fall into the category of those peculiar WTF commentators who get angry with female guests because they are females.

There are then about 20 ‘critical or mixed-critical/negative posts. These aren’t actually the misogyny people. They are ‘normal criticisms’ (many mixed with compliments) normal reviews.

Okay then.. and i find this as disgusting as anything - about 20 who are almost ‘randomly’ accusing someone else of ‘racism’ and ‘hating women’ (these are garbageheads).

Then finally.. and this is really wtf pathetic - finally we have the majority of posts being people just saying they are outraged and disappointed at the 10 misogyny posts,
acting like they are seeing the whole board full of those comments.
Posting ‘as if’ they are the special one who’s putting their foot down and calling out in the middle of the negativity.
Wow talk about screwed up.

*If you think I’m off on the guesstimate and categories - please feel free to read through the comments and tell me what figures you came up with?
      MOST are positive/normal critiques without any gender comments/people ‘calling out the board on all the imaginary insult posts.

(personally, i find all the ‘White Knight’ or ‘Liberal Douchey Defender’ posts almost as sickening as the women-hater posts in their own special ways heh)

mingus-fungus March 24, 2014 at 10:23 am

Made the mistake of googling Lena’s parents to view their artwork. What pompous, unskilled, talentless “artists” they are. Art is everything when anything is considered art.

Kevin In Philadelphia March 24, 2014 at 5:05 pm

I came because marc siad most of you are horrible people, and I had to see for mself. Yeah…he’s right. Too many of you are completely fucking awful.

Until this episode I was unfamiliar with lena Dunham other than the shitty things people have said about her. She seems genuine and thoughtful, regardless of whether her show is your cup of tea or not. I guess there was some pretension to her, but no more than any other native NYer I’ve come across (I’m from Philadelphia, I admit that it is a heavy chip on my shoulder over the city to the North), and I liked that she still seemed human and aware of her faults and successes. I’m going to give Girls a shot now, based on the fact that if the characters are writte nand smartly as the creator sounds, I’l likely enjoy it. Anyway, thanks Maron for a another good episode.

D March 24, 2014 at 8:16 pm

Whatever her body looks like and the discomfort it causes is the point. She expresses discomfort and egotistical half baked ideas in her shows.  Her show is self confessing and she populates it with pushed types of despicable, lost young women. I needed that. I didnt need a bunch of piggish men criticizing a body that is fearlessly out there and not actress thin. Youre stoking the dialogue. She looks from a distance at the follies and ugliness of her characters and exaggerates it as a confession of how weird and uncomfortable it is to figure your shit out as a mid 20s middle class cyclone of gentrification. All she did on the podcast was talk about art and feminism. What was so obnoxious? Your reaction is outsized. Youre treating her like lenny bruce. I love you marc.

Nicollette March 25, 2014 at 3:33 pm

Lena Dunham is an artist and obviously a good one to evoke so much emotion. I know most consumers of popular media have no context for viewing art. It’s function is to shed lite on truth, the truth of the artist, which is something she goes quite well. Maybe you don’t give a shit about what it’s like for and average girl with a brain growing up and reckoning with society today. No her voice is not everyones, whose is?

The reason she is so hated is because is simply because she is seen as unfuckable and the idea of a woman, a young woman, who you aren’t attracted to having sexual freedom and daring to let us see it is SO threatening to the the white male dominate paradigm it actually threatens society!

Yes she’s obnoxious, yes she’s awkward and yes she’s SMART! You don’t like it? Fine, but sit down and shut the fuck up. It’s time for a new voice to be heard and it doesn’t need your approval.


HoboJones March 25, 2014 at 4:59 pm

Wow…like Marc said, the comments here are rather bad. Saying that…I kinda now feel guilty that I still don’t like her. I think its the combination of her coming from total privilege, and yet having a persecution complex. Also the fact that she is so young…yet seems eager to instruct others on their shortcomings. Sadly (I suppose for me) it doesn’t help that I think she’s chubby and unattractive…and that her voice sounds like an adolescent.

tanselle March 25, 2014 at 8:57 pm

If you watch her show, Girls, you quickly discover every female character is incredibly unappealing, especially Lena’s character, self-absorbed, shellfish, disloyal, and shallow.  Of course it’s great Mark interviews her, now we can see how different her character is from the writer.  Interesting to discover she’s less interesting, more shallow, more self-absorbed, and so needy of attention that as the interview went on, the less likeable she became.  She did answer the big question on everyone’s mind…why would someone so unattractive get naked on camera, so often…she wants attention.

Christopher March 26, 2014 at 3:30 pm

I liked it. Interesting free flowing conversation rather than the usual podcast arc going from starting out to where she is now.

Robert March 27, 2014 at 3:00 am

Marc, I sincerely hope you disinfected the garage after your interview with Lena. Her oily, wet stains are the stuff of legend!

Jill March 27, 2014 at 10:51 am

Lena has more class than any of you haters could ever dream to have. And most of you can’t even spell. Get the hell over it. Kudos to Marc for calling out all the ridiculous people who left such horrible comments.

ikdks March 27, 2014 at 12:01 pm

I don’t think Lena Dunham said anything egregious, so this isn’t directed at her specifically.  She seems like a nice young woman.

But I have some general advice for wealthy educated successful women.  Understand that you have benefited greatly from the society that you live in.  Realize that you are privileged, that you have advantages that many people, including white men, did not have. 

If you grew up in a two parent house, if you grew up middle or upper middle class, if you went to college, if you make a six figure salary, realize that that puts you at an advantage that vastly outweighs the advantage of simply being a white male.

Because if you then complain that you are in fact underprivileged because you make 1.2 million dollars, but a man in your position made 1.6 million dollars, and you blame that on men in general, there is a guy in a trailer park getting by on a part time job and food stamps that will take offence to that, and rightly so, frankly.  Think of Romney’s 47% speech, or that guy that said that the rich are like Jews in Nazzi Germany, that’s what you sound like to them.

And because these people haven’t had the benefit of education, because they are somewhat warped by poverty and degradation, they aren’t going to write a lyrical dissertation on their plight, they’re going to make monkey noises.  They’re going to call you fat and ugly, because it the only way they have to express the feelings inside them.  But just because it isn’t articulate, doesn’t mean it’s not valid.

There is simply no politically correct agenda toward white men, no sensitivity training for how not to offend people who are white and male, but tickle us and do we not laugh?  White men are human beings who can be offended just like everybody else.

So here’s a rule of thumb I suggest to women who are particularly possessed with woman’s issues.  Before you say anything about “Men”, put the word “Black” in front of it.  If it suddenly sounds ignorant, don’t say it.

If you read a Slate article suggesting that woman shouldn’t get black out drunk so they don’t get attacked (good advice for everyone), and your impulse is to say “Maybe men should stop raping”, try saying “Maybe black men should stop raping” (Because you really are saying that, black men are men).  If it sounds ignorant toward black men, it’s also ignorant toward men in general.

tom March 28, 2014 at 3:56 pm

27 is not the 2:30 of your life it’s like still before noon i mean just like average lifespan you know

Smitty March 28, 2014 at 11:48 pm

no one automatically knows,just because they think they do,or feel that they are supposed to. what’s lost in most of the comments, is that there is a middle road here. i think that much of what Lena thinks about the world, and gender specifically, is incomplete and challengeable. i’d be so nice if we got away from the “pedestal and the gutter”,and stepped back with some open objectivity.

Efram March 31, 2014 at 8:29 am

Why is Dunham’s show called Girls? Why not just be honest and call it Jews?

Clovis April 01, 2014 at 9:41 pm

I want to second Stuart’s comments up top. Good lord, Lena Dunham is a handful. A group of democratic socialists could turn into fascists listening to her privileged, tone deaf nonsense.

Kent April 03, 2014 at 3:35 am

This was a good interview Marc, thank you. Let me point out something to the Marc fans who are trashing Lena Dunham. Have you never heard of a manic angry depressed lunatic called Marc Maron? Have you never heard him talk about how he burned all his bridges in his career? Have you never heard of the anger he had for his ex wife? Have you never heard him read the insane letter he wrote to her calling her a sociopath amongst other things. Have you never heard of how he used to make his wife cry just to see if she still cared. Yeah that guy.

That guy had a pleasant conversation with Lena Dunham and came away with no hatred. What does that say about you?

That said, i can’t say I came away with a wholly positive opinion of her, but it was definitely not hatred, nor do I care about her looks. I was neutral on Lena Dunham before listening to this, and came away sort of confused about who she really was really.

She seems nice if perhaps way out of touch with the world at large. She’s open to holding simultaneously contradictory feelings about Woody Allen and his art, but she’s not open to holding simultaneously contradicting feelings about his guilt or non guilt. She has room for non judgementalism in art, but not in people. She’s already judged Woody, whereas the rest of us, or at least me are able to withhold judgement in absence of clear evidence. Marc never really picked up on that.

On the surface she’s nice and engaging, but there are a lot of anxieties and neurosis there that makes her exhausting to listen to. It reminded me of when Seinfeld interviewed Howard Stern. That was a tough interview because he was completely preoccupied with negative side of everything.

You wonder if it’s an act, and if not, how can someone rich and successful really suffer from that much neurotic self obsession. Anxiety is a mental illness, but it’s a treatable one. It would have been nice if Marc dipped into that more as his success seemed to tame his problems.

Justin April 06, 2014 at 12:50 am

I’m post 100!

My previous theory has been proven out - MOST of the posts were people expressing disgust at all the negative posts.
MOST of the other posts were genuine criticisms/praises really just commenting on good and bad aspects.

Only about 5 were the misogyny guys.

5 were just hating but weren’t gender-related hate.
1 was hassling Jews.

I can’t believe she asked Marc to host a secret meeting of comedians who’d learn what words they weren’t allowed to use anymore.

Anyways - good stuff!

MVH April 07, 2014 at 3:04 pm

You can see why MM is taking down the comments from the website. Good idea. Troll city. How disappointing.

Love the show. Hate the comments.

Candace K. April 14, 2014 at 10:53 am

I’m really surprised by the strongly negative emotions expressed in the comments for Lena Dunham.  I feel like that level of distaste should be reserved for people who are truly putting evil into this world, but hey, that’s just me grin  I like the show “Girls”, not every moment in every episode, but I still think overall it’s smart and funny.  Each of the characters have moments where they’re likable and then not so likable, but I think that’s true of most of us.  I absolutely enjoyed listening to her and Marc talk.  I felt like they really connected and had fun talking about a ton of different things in a short amount of time, and I was lucky enough to be part of the conversation.  It’s no accident that she’s had so much success at such a young age, she’s bright, funny, smart and confident in her abilities, even with the public feeling they have a right to say awful things to her like she’s not human like the rest of us.  Do I wish she wasn’t naked in every episode?  Yes, but that’s my own body insecurities screaming at her not to let the world see every nook and cranny that they will then discuss and make fun of.  I liked her before this interview, but now I adore her.

Smitty April 14, 2014 at 5:06 pm

how the hell do you know Philip Roth is “a goddamn animal”.. based on one womans account?!  i guess it’s very much about “selective objectivity” for this gal.  she too easily retrofits a given reality, in order to bolster an expedient pont. that’s sloppy morality at best,and intellectual deceit at worst.

Justin April 15, 2014 at 10:50 pm

There are not a bunch of negative comments about Lena or women here.

Almost ALL the ‘negative comments’ are from Marc and people copying Marc and saying really mean things about the comments,
pretending they are disgusted with all the negative comments about women or Lena - and really there is just a handful.

Actually most were totally valid well-said honest opinions and very very few were ‘trolls’ or causing any trouble.

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There might often be Injuries in Running
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