Greg Shields February 06, 2012 at 8:31 am

Marc, I usually like your podcasts and find them interesting and entertaining. I’ve never heard of Matt Graham, but he seemed cool.

When you say “Catch” when you mean Catch a Rising Star, it just sounds pretentious and smug. When you say “Louis” when you mean Louis CK, it just sounds pretentious and smug.

I get most of your references, but many may not. We are not all in “the club”, so just keep that in mind.

Cheers from Hong Kong.

DCummings February 06, 2012 at 10:07 am

I had mixed feelings about this interview.  I know in my head that I should have found Matt’s story compelling and intense.  I should have been really interested in the path his life has taken.  However, I ended up simply finding him to be abrasive and somewhat annoying.  Perhaps it was his constant injections of “you know” as he spoke.  Trivial, I know, but for a guy who is lauded for being articulate with exceptional verbal skills he was tough to listen to.

I think I would prefer to read a biography (or better yet, an autobiography) of Matt Graham than to listen to the man himself.

jimjim February 06, 2012 at 11:07 am

thanks Matt for sharing your story.  i’m enjoying your Conan appearances on youtube.  keep up the comedy

Greg February 06, 2012 at 11:13 am

Very interesting interview.  My first response is to root for this guy, not out of sympathy but because it is clear that he is highly intelligent and articulate.  Out of curiosity, I Googled him, and found this YouTube clip, making me the 309th person to view it.  I know it is old, but it was strikingly funny, and perhaps insightful as to how the difficulties in one’s life can work their way into one’s art.  If his current comedic efforts are anywhere near as clever as this clip, then he deserves to be heard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJFSxfMLcM

a listener February 06, 2012 at 11:21 am

Wow, that was just sad.  Can the depression episodes go out on Thursdays instead of Mondays? Sheesh.  Every WTF episode is a great listen, but gosh that sad-sackery was tough to take on a Monday morning.

Stay positive Matt - you sound like a smart, funny person and you’ll find what you’re looking for if you stick around for the search.

Liliana February 06, 2012 at 11:44 am

Hi Marc, that was strange and I feel bad because the guy e insane and not in a good way.
He really needs mental help, like real help.
But Marc you are awesome, I love your podcasts.

S February 06, 2012 at 12:23 pm

Gosh. Thank you for this. Maybe truth is the sensational thing. I hope you guys hugged.

M February 06, 2012 at 12:37 pm

This was really hard to listen to.

JNR February 06, 2012 at 12:38 pm

It’s my own personal prejudice, but i find people like Matt very annoying to listen to because they say “You know” with the frequency of a verbal tic. If I were kinder I would accept that they are really saying ‘You do NOT understand, do you?’ and are making an appeal for understanding that they are used to having dismissed.

BOP February 06, 2012 at 12:53 pm

You know, this guy, you know, Matt, you know, should really, you know, be institutionalized, you know, locked away in an asylum away from the rest of society, you know, since he seems to be a, you know, paranoid schizophrenic, you know.

danryan February 06, 2012 at 1:16 pm

Great stuff again Marc.

Coming from a fellow nerve-weaver... February 06, 2012 at 2:03 pm

This guy is obviously really intelligent and capable. The only reason I see for his reoccurring social downfalls is that 1) he keeps calling himself a loser as if he’s trying to convince everyone, 2) he is extremely confrontational. There is some deep-seeded resentment that caused him to call out Marc at the end.
Convert to Zen Buddhism or something, man. Calm. Down.

Shannon February 06, 2012 at 2:20 pm

Calling himself an old loner isn’t doing himself any favors. It’s good that he recognizes he’s having some mental issues but I think there’s still some work to do. Perhaps his next stop can be on MentalPod. I mean, you know?

Renaud February 06, 2012 at 2:45 pm

It’s important that people who struggle with their mental health like Matt can tell their stories to the world, one way or another, so good job on that. One relative of mine had deep mental problems (arguably worse that Matt’s I think) and I never could get myself to spend time with her, because this was too fucking scary for me to deal with. She later committed suicide. I don’t think there is any one day I do not remember her and feel ashamed for my cowardice. If you go down to the root of that kind mental hang-ups, the amount of suffering and pain you see is just terrifying.

Mark February 06, 2012 at 3:52 pm

Always enjoy the podcast and especially enjoyed this episode. Wanted to give people a heads up that they can watch Word Wars, the documentary about tournament scrabble play featuring Matt Graham, on Hulu for free at: http://www.hulu.com/watch/298170/word-wars.

grind February 06, 2012 at 4:10 pm

it’s a perfect day for banana fish…
:(

MPG February 06, 2012 at 4:38 pm

You know.
You know.
You know.
You know.
You know.

Justin February 06, 2012 at 5:02 pm

That was heavy and disturbing and yet fascinating and maybe even therapeutic for Graham and in some ways I wish I missed it for the enraging emotional reaction I had. In another way I wouldn’t want to miss it. Honestly, there is a time and place for a mental hospital. Not old style lock-ups but for the real sincere purpose of protecting his safety and that of others.

HellsYeah February 06, 2012 at 5:13 pm

I get it.  Hearing “you know” and “like” uttered every other word is a pain to hear from any average word weary person. But being annoyed by someone with mental health issues for repeatedly saying the words “you know”, is like being annoyed with someone with Parkinson’s for having the shakes. I took it all in with the mania and paranoia. This episode was extremely difficult to hear, and I applaud Marc for taking on an old friend with some serious issues. I just hope Matt continues to get help, because it sounds like he’s still struggling.

TomStockman February 06, 2012 at 5:21 pm

If Matt Graham ever comes to Atlanta I’ll see him. I hope he finds success and happiness. Live long and prosper, Matt.

MPG February 06, 2012 at 6:01 pm

HellsYeah, yeah, I wrote the multiple “you know"s before I knew the depths of his insanity. I feel bad.
It was the most depressing WTF to date. Also, like the Garofolo episode, I felt more like I was a therapist than an audience member.
I wouldn’t recommend this one to anyone.

Tregeek February 06, 2012 at 7:09 pm

sorry Mark but this guy is no where near funny as he thinks he is and his word breaks are horrible. needs to take an intro speech class if he intends to do anymore public speaking. u on the other hand rule as usual. love ya man

Pablo February 06, 2012 at 7:15 pm

I wish I could unhear the second part of the interview. Nothing was gained, and I sort of agree with Matt’s sentiment of being used in a sensationalist way. As for the verbal tics, he seemed worked up and uncomfortable, which can make otherwise articulate people fumble for words. Let’s not forget that he was driven to discuss a psychotic self-decapitation event for an audience of thousands of people.

Butterfinger_Bandit February 06, 2012 at 7:34 pm

You kind of crossed a line here Marc, Matt was clearly not mentally stable enough for this kind of scrutiny. I understand he’s an adult, but he was almost literally begging you for money by the end of show. How can you air this knowing the harm it cause, to this sick man’s fragile ego?

Matt Graham is clearly not mentally stable, he still won’t admit, in so many words, that his manic episodes were the result of innate mental problems and clearly persists in a self-destructively narcissistic mind set. Marc with all respect, you should not give someone like this a platform in which to indulge narcissistic fantasies it could exacerbate the problem.

Will February 06, 2012 at 8:06 pm

This guy is a mess and difficult to listen to. I don’t find him compelling.

Sam February 06, 2012 at 8:18 pm

Hey everybody!  Let’s all be judgmental assholes!

Dan Buskirk February 06, 2012 at 8:26 pm

Awesome interview, I appreciate Matt’s honesty and humor I found him to be genuinely funny, and interesting, never more so than when speaking off the cuff.  It’s a stressful world and a stressful time, here’s hoping that Matt gets over some of the obstacles in front of him.  Would love to see his (hopefully) upcoming show.

xx February 06, 2012 at 8:54 pm

had to turn this off after the 50th “you know,” is it worth listening to the whole thing

Guest February 06, 2012 at 9:51 pm

Well, that was kind of harsh to listen to, especially the last five minutes. I hope his fortunes improve.

bron February 06, 2012 at 10:08 pm

good lord

Dan Buskirk February 06, 2012 at 10:09 pm

What’s the matter with me,  I didn’t notice the “you knows” at all!  I think it is Graham’s vulnerability that has been a turn-off for some, especially since admitting yourself “a loser” is a major taboo in our hyper-competitive society.  I thought this was one of Marc’s most intriguing episodes, both because Graham is so obviously brilliant, thoughtful, funny and troubled and because it beings up questions of exploitation on both parties.  Dramatic stuff, and undoubtedly too close to home for many.

Catherine M. February 06, 2012 at 10:25 pm

“You’re a sensationalist… and I’m a whore, and you know… it’s probably a tie.”

This.

charles February 06, 2012 at 10:27 pm

i really think you should have cut out the last five minutes. the guy is fucking delusional, that’s not fair.

John February 06, 2012 at 11:21 pm

Very interesting and honest podcast, not what I was expecting at all.  It was a little disturbing to hear Marc laughing off what seemed to be significant mania and paranoia.  I hope this guy has some friends and family that get him the helps he needs, because I don’t think he can do it himself.  If the drug use he discussed has anything to do with his current mental state, it shows there is a real dark side the stand-up comedy lifestyle. 

On a lighter note, I slowly understood why an SNL writer/talk-show guest got rejected for online dates 170 times in a row.

Skymaster T February 06, 2012 at 11:28 pm

I love the podcasts, but this one was meh. I know you’ll come back with a great one like you always do after the bland shit. Rock on!

paluk February 06, 2012 at 11:42 pm

misfire.  the hook of this episode (other than your guys’ personal history) was matt’s suicide attempt and his loss of touch to the rest of us, apropos to nothing.  it was just sad. if you were wanting to show off your ability to get people to expose things about themselves they shouldn’t, you succeeded.  if you were hoping this would be an interview that would reflect even slightly positively on either of you;  fail.

Mark Elow February 06, 2012 at 11:50 pm

Matt’s featured in the movie Word Wars, a 2004 documentary featuring four pro Scrabble players. It’s worth checking out if you have access to it (Instant Streaming on Netflix). Matt comes across as one of more normal people in the film.

theo February 07, 2012 at 12:21 am

that shit was heavy, i hope he sits down and listens to the episode himself.

Jay February 07, 2012 at 12:35 am

I hope Marc addresses the ethical considerations of exposing his friend this way. Other guests have discussed their issues and struggles, but Matt Graham didn’t seem very self aware. Graham is clearly brilliant and funny, but it’s not hard to see why he was fired from SNL, or cut from his college basketball team. He seems like an energy-sucking vortex of negativity with a serious persecution complex. “Pity me” isn’t a winning attitude for a comic. I feel his pain, and I hope it doesn’t squelch his brilliance.

Erik February 07, 2012 at 1:19 am

Matt will obviously read everyrhing posted here, Bandit’s comment about Marc crossing a line is just going to troll and backhandedly insult him.I think this was a great episode, and being severely depressed myself I understand everything (except trying to cut my head off) down to the drug abuse and verbal tics. I didn’t see this a sensatonalistic or taking advantage of him, just a very real and open discussion about how horrible life is when you’re mentally unstable.

Kyle February 07, 2012 at 3:10 am

Your heart has to go out to the guy. Just checked him out for the first time, talented guy. I hope some success come his way and with it maybe a little more positive outlook on the world.

Richard February 07, 2012 at 3:53 am

Thanks for your story, Matt.  Best of luck to you.

grind February 07, 2012 at 4:43 am

this guy puts the “what the fuck?!” in the WTF.

:(

Jonah February 07, 2012 at 4:43 am

I so wish that this guy did a podcast of his own.  He reminds me of Marc at his most self-loathing and frustrated, like in the early days of WTF.  I don’t care how much he says “you know”.  I’ve only listened halfway through so far.  Also he seems very funny, and obviously smart.

Chris February 07, 2012 at 4:59 am

Jonah that’s exactly how I was feeling part way through the episode, and couldn’t understand all the negative comments, boy is that second half brutal. This dude is trying to stage a comeback and can’t help but obsess over the attractiveness of young women on the internet he spends his days trying to pick up on, then lacks the awareness to call them cunts after he treats them poorly? And seriously how many times can you call yourself a clever and poor misunderstood artist while reveling in your alcoholic suicidal past in the course of one hour.

jimjim February 07, 2012 at 8:45 am

I can’t understand why anyone would leave a comment here before listening to the entire episode.  Seriously, who cares about a guests verbal ticks?  Lighten up. 

Matt is obviously a very talented standup, which is why so many of his peers looked up to him back when he was performing.  His Conan appearances on youtube speak for themselves.

I hope with continued sobriety, a return to the stage, and therapy he will grow into a happier person.

ChasePage February 07, 2012 at 9:01 am

This was the most uncomfortable thing I’ve listened to in a very long time. I need a drink.

MeMeMe February 07, 2012 at 10:02 am

You could take Matt’s interview as an opportunity to express your dislike for his personality and to dismiss him.  You could also take it as a chance to think about pain, loneliness, and unfairness.  Which one do you think is more enriching?

Shaun February 07, 2012 at 11:48 am

This guy makes Marc seem like the normal one.

Chris February 07, 2012 at 12:31 pm

Enlighten me mememe, what useful information is there to be gleaned from listening to this sociopath, besides to figure out how to avoid ending up anything like he has?

Dan Buskirk February 07, 2012 at 1:18 pm

Don’t worry Chris, a guy like you could never lose.

james February 07, 2012 at 1:23 pm

Chris,
For me personally, it was informative hearing about the difference between suicide based on psychosis vs depression.  Matt made very clear that the psychotic episode in which he attempted the absurd task of cutting his head off with a butter knife was attributed to his drug use combined with mental issues.

There is also hope offered in this interview.  His incident was 13 years ago, and he has been sober ever since and he’s finally getting back into performing (which he was GREAT at).  Of course he still has a rough road ahead of him, but I think everything will continue to improve if he works hard with a therapist on his depression and social problems.

anyway, thanks Marc and Matt for putting this out there.  lots of dialogue is coming from it

Gloria February 07, 2012 at 1:55 pm

Words fail me.  Matt—please get help.  You’re bright, and talented, but clearly in need of therapy.  And not all of us women are soul-sucking c_nts.

Maria February 07, 2012 at 2:51 pm

Matt is no doubt brilliant and also mad as a fucking hatter.
That disturbing combo of superiority complex wrapped in an inferiority complex.
I can understand why you like and care about the guy but perhaps helping him reign his ideas in would have been helpful. Certainly less cringe inducing to listen to.
His position on women is where he made it clear he needs serious help. Matt, YOU are the problem, not the women.

He obviously has been digging holes in his life and blaming everyone else for it the whole time.
If he is truly as intelligent as he brags about he should understand the need to get some professional guidance. Otherwise he is only an occasionally somewhat humorous blow-hard.

Robin February 07, 2012 at 3:26 pm

I felt very sorry for this guy. But the thing that stood out to me throughout the interview(s) was that he never acknowledged another person’s feelings, needs, or the validity of their actions. It was distressing to listen to. It seemed that everybody was described in terms of whether they liked him, admired him or what they could do for him. His comments about women, and the encounters he describes, made me feel literally ill.

It makes sense that he loves scrabble, as he wants to stay in his own head. This episode left me me with a deep resolve not to feel sorry for myself or be too self-involved, it leads to misery. Listening to other people and considering their needs is the only way to connect to them. I hope he gets into some deep therapy and learns to be happier, kinder, more connected.

Renaud February 07, 2012 at 3:39 pm

I’ve learned to understand that when people experienced psychosis or near psychotic episodes, one of the many consequences is an acute sense of isolation and an impossibility to connect to others that lingers long after the breakdown itself. It’s easy to dismiss this as self-centeredness but I think it misses the ponit entirely. Psychotherapy, if undergone early, can really help, but then again I think Matt did not get what he needed in that regard. By the way, I think Matt is totally harmless, to women or anyone else for that matter He’s obviously the only one indanger here.

Robin February 07, 2012 at 3:41 pm

I just wanted to add something. I know someone similar to this (not quite as intense, but close) and they did get quite a bit better and are happier now. So it is possible. But they needed to do a lot of meditation and therapy and admit their own responsibility (they may have gotten drug therapy, too, I don’t know) . However, I don’t know if reviving a career in show business sounds healthy to me for someone like Matt (who I interpret as being narcissistic). No matter how talented he is, health and happiness are more important. I just wanted to add this in because I expect he will probably read these comments and reading a bunch of negative comments is just fuel for a good self-bashing session, which seems to be his go-to. It must be very overwhelming to suddenly be on a podcast and have many people listening to your personal struggles. It would be a shame if he didn’t use the experience for something positive.

John February 07, 2012 at 4:26 pm

The stuff with selling the game Vegas at the end was really depressing.

Cone February 07, 2012 at 5:35 pm

Gloria you don’t need to apologize for yourself because of some asshole’s misogyny.

jane February 07, 2012 at 5:43 pm

I saw matt’s show and he talks about many of the same difficult topics he does in this podcast, but with a very different attitude.  I found him charming, insightful, self-effacing and refreshingly honest.  He’s also uniquely funny.

UltimateOutsider February 07, 2012 at 7:01 pm

I’m 3/4 of the way through this one, but I already sense the change in tone of the second interview. It’s unfortunate that folks are so hung up on the guy’s verbal tics, because there’s such a detailed portrait of humanity in these 72 minutes. This episode may be a hard listen, but that doesn’t make it bad.

Jeremy February 07, 2012 at 7:36 pm

With friends like these…

I’m surprised there’s not a lot more criticism of Mr. Maron for deciding to release something like this. This did no good for Mr. Graham and I didn’t see anything either entertaining or enlightening about someone being interviewed about reaching such a state in their own life that they try to cut their own head off.

This episode challenges the notion that all publicity is good publicity and I now question whether Mr. Maron’s personal growth is real at all as the decision to make something like this public shows a true lack of sympathy or empathy, especially for someone who he considered a friend and a professional inspiration.

Just because something is “real” or “true” doesn’t mean that it should be made public, especially in a podcast that at the end of the day only exists to entertain and to sell the goods of the sponsors, Mr. Maron’s merchandise, and his performances.

JC February 07, 2012 at 7:58 pm

It was a very interesting and illuminating interview.  Thanks Matt for sharing your darkest moments with us.  You’re a quivering nerve- I mean that in a good way.  Hope you get what you want in life.  I’m rooting for you.

Mike February 07, 2012 at 11:42 pm

Wow, very unexpected interview but so powerful, which it would not have been without the second half. 
I don’t think Mark did the second half because of the “juicy” suicide attempt-as a pure story it was interesting but not that sensational- I think he sensed that the true Matt had not really been brought forward.
Kudos to Matt for recognizing that he needs to socialize more. My guess is that it will help him a great deal, not as much as therapy would but…..
Great job Mark, I will be thinking about this one for a long time - in a good way.

Mike February 07, 2012 at 11:45 pm

Marc, Marc, Marc.  Sorry, I know its not Mark.

Mt February 07, 2012 at 11:49 pm

Greg Shields, keep in mind that when you say “dim sum”, you sound pretentious and smug.

Justin February 08, 2012 at 6:48 am

Can I point out something that seems to be missed in the criticisms:
The 1st Interview goes reasonably well and while Graham has problems you can still see how the interview may have been entirely therapeutic and helpful for all involved.
[time passes]
[Yes, Marc may have heard part of the story that happened in the mean-time]
Interview #2 happens. It happens ‘as it happens’. Marc might be as surprised and disturbed as anyone else.
*I mention this because some are criticizing ‘as if’ it were somehow happening in real time and/or Marc would somehow know how Graham would react (or even what he would reveal) or his state of mind when Marc returned to talk to him.
Heck, Marc himself might have realized, halfway through, this was a really bad situation going wrong - however - that is what happened. So that is ‘what happened’ and what we heard.

Justin February 08, 2012 at 7:56 am

Duly note: I’m on some fairly strong pain-killers and it turns out scotch ‘magnifies’ the effect. Sorry if my post is on crazy pills. Try and work through it to get the idea. Thanks.
I’m awesome.

grind February 08, 2012 at 9:11 am

he was “getting it on” with a girl on a bike path…
is this a mac davis interview?
:(
p.s.  after listening to this interview it makes me want to cut my head off -  hide the butter knives!

Annie February 08, 2012 at 9:45 am

I’m kind of surprised at many of the comments here. Contrary to what others have said, I didn’t really find this that difficult to listen to at all. Matt seemed fine to me, aside for the whole attempting to slice off his own head thing that is. Somehow I didn’t notice the verbal tics either. The response here has made me a little anxious, perhaps my failure to recognize Matt’s craziness means I should question my own sanity, either that or Sam’s right, everyone’s just being judgemental ass holes, I’m inclined towards that assessment. Don’t get me wrong the guy clearly had some issues, he definitely came across as depressed and neurotic but who amongst us isn’t to some extent? His attitude towards women was pretty off putting and selling Marc that game at the end felt kind of weird and inappropriate but I think those things can be attributed not so much to mental instability but to the kind of honest/abrasive personality type that makes people like him both interesting and slightly annoying. All that aside, for the most part, he came across as an intelligent and funny guy, I hope things start looking up for him and Ruth.

kyle February 08, 2012 at 10:57 am

I like Annie’s comments, above.
I didn’t notice the verbal tics and I found the interview really interesting, although the game/money thing at the end was a little heartbreaking and kind of put the whole interview in a different light.
Quite honestly I’ve found some of the comments above more difficult to get through than the interview.
I always enjoy the garage and hotel room interviews for their honesty and intimacy, the live shows not-so-much, except maybe the one Ira Glass was on…
Thanks for a great podcast, keep them coming.

Catseye February 08, 2012 at 3:00 pm

Stopped listening after 5 minutes of “you know?”  He probably doesn’t even realize he’s doing it, you know?  But it drives me up the wall and over it, you know?  Sorry, I just can’t take it, you know?

wilberfan February 08, 2012 at 4:06 pm

This must be what it feels like to have a loved one suffering a mental illness—and not knowing what to do to help them…

He’s very clearly gone on the record and stated that he’s depressed, isolated, delusional, and otherwise messed-up.  If he doesn’t get some help, we’ll all feel bad (guilty?) when the worst happens to him (or by him).

But what can we do?

BP February 08, 2012 at 5:07 pm

I really hope Marc addresses the ethical implications of releasing this episode.  In the second interview Matt shows himself to be a misogynist and out of touch with reality, leading up to essentially asking Marc for money.  And yet Marc felt that for some reason it would be good to include this interview on the podcast, knowing full well that thousands of people would hear it and that Matt is attempting to engage again with the standup community.  How is releasing this helpful?

Michael February 08, 2012 at 5:25 pm

I too agree with Annie’s take. And to those slamming Marc for doing the interview….puhlease!
Maybe Marc was doing Matt a huge favour for allowing him to be heard again….Marc may have made a promise to a troubled and forgotten friend to let him be heard and he followed through on the promise, probably knowing in hindsight after playing back the interview that he was going to cop some flak. But getting this out there might be the break that Matt needs in his life…from a career and personal development perspective.

Keep ‘em comin’ Marc and keep taking the risks required to keep your podcast real.

Ed February 08, 2012 at 6:49 pm

Interesting show. I knew of Matt from Word Freak, a book I enjoyed tremendously. I was surprised Matt disliked the book so much. I thought Fatsis portrayed him as a talented, smart guy with some considerable idiosyncrasies (the smart pill thing for one). In any case, if Matt didn’t like the book, being in the movie doesn’t make any sense to me.

From the way Matt sounded here it seems like the competitive life of poker and scrabble is getting to him. Not the most grounded, easy going lifestyle apparently. Bro needs to chill more, attempt to excel less.

Anyway, best of luck Matt. I look forward to hearing your new material.

bob February 08, 2012 at 7:37 pm

This episode is a seminar on mania. The self medicating, excuses and delusions of grandeur, the random oddball schemes to make money, gambling not because he’s addicted but because he has invented a ‘system’, and the “I hate you, please don’t leave me” mentality. And just listen to the difference between the first segment and the 2nd.

This kind of mania is infinite in its destructive ability and it was painful to listen to. I hope the guy gets the help he needs. Marc probably thinbob@bob.comks releasing this will be good for him and make him face it. But that’s not how it works. This episode and all of the related feedback will just be distorted by the mania and used to reinforce itself.

bob February 08, 2012 at 7:48 pm

Forgot to mention hearing voices, seeing things, psychotic attempt at suicide.  All classic mania. Bad manic episodes mimic paranoid schizophrenia,  the difference is that they come and go.

Surprised Marc didn’t pick up on this since his dad was bipolar and surely exhibited similar signs to some degree. Especially the comment about telling people on the street another the basketball scheme.

BostonMiltonQuincy February 08, 2012 at 8:13 pm

Really interesting 1st half, grueling 2nd half. show, especially the last minute. Matt’s obviously an intelligent, super articulate comic with issues. Don’t all comics have issues? isn’t that what makes them funny? Marc??  U could have cut the last minute.

Matt, ur depression increases anxiety. The total rejection that goes along with anyone’s stand up may be too much at this point.  You have been successful writing jokes. Keep at that. It’s more behind the scenes. You defiantly have much to offer. Plus, your cat needs you!

Marc - attended the Boston show. Very, very fun!

Becky February 08, 2012 at 8:44 pm

Maybe it’s wrong to offer advice to someone who hasn’t asked for it but…Matt might find that the world makes more sense when he examines the role he plays in his own life.  He can change that script but it takes self-reflection and honesty.  Perhaps therapy.  And lots of comedy.

Victor Vacendak February 08, 2012 at 9:07 pm

Hoping this leads someone to help this guy. I never noticed the “you knows” but my skin crawled at what seemed like Matt’s isolation from his own feelings. This is really going to inspire me to get out more often.

Ivan February 08, 2012 at 9:29 pm

I love the mixture of honesty and comedy in the WTF podcast. But, this podcast was tough to get through. Matt has so much anger and loneliness. I pray he does what ever it takes to move past the anger.

brainfur February 08, 2012 at 9:52 pm

Wow, this was a GREAT episode…  I love hearing about guys that might be less successful but have had really intense weird interesting lives.  I live in the city, so tell Matt that I would definitely come see him perform next time he does his show!

sara February 08, 2012 at 11:06 pm

ugh. PLEASE TURN OFF THE COMMENTS, Marc
this is cruel and too much for my soul to take. I hope Matt never reads any of these

if he does - Matt, just know that there are people out there who are kind and gentle. people who care for the kind of cat that doesn’t know any better, the kind who lays out in the middle of the street

Jed February 08, 2012 at 11:31 pm

I agree with Jeremy above. I really have to question Marc’s need to expose his friend like this. He brought him back just to make him talk about his suicide attempt? It was ugly and exploitative
and I don’t see the entertainment value, or any other value, in it. I’ll keep listening, but it may be a while to get the bad taste out of my mouth, and maybe I don’t think of Marc as quite so benevolent any more.

ziggy February 09, 2012 at 4:12 am

Positive: Had not heard of him and he is quite funny on youtube/Conan. Someone should hire him as a writer to mail in material. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zJFSxfMLcM  

Negative: all of the above comments. I was actually starting to wonder if it was a fake guest like Marc used to do. I also think some editorial judgement was needed. And for everyone who didn’t notice the endless language ticks: WTF language do you speak????????

Jimbo February 09, 2012 at 4:20 am

While this episode didn’t reflect particularly well on either one of them, is it really Marc’s responsibility to only release upbeat, positive and helpful interviews? I don’t recall hearing a definition of the WTF Moral Standards at the beginning of any episode. I think Marc’s pretty much winging it and seeing what happens.

I personally wouldn’t have released this episode, but I’m also not the owner of a successful podcast that is running out of famous comedic guests to interview.

This episode has definitely pushed me a little closer to disliking the podcast, and if I hear more episodes that I dislike I’ll probably “vote with my feet” and stop listening to this often-funny and FREE podcast.

ziggy February 09, 2012 at 4:35 am

Jimbo, no but you just indicated why someone might have chosen not to include the 2nd part, or even just cut the end.

Btw, funniest & most delusional moment: Marc jokingly asks about scrabble and girls, pause, sincere reply: “Some think its kinda hot”.

Joe Tily February 09, 2012 at 5:15 am

. . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know . . . . . . you know what i mean?

Smith February 09, 2012 at 9:28 am

“...as they all are, on some level, soul-crushing cunts.”

Difficult interview (er, monologue) to listen to, but this just capped it for me. I have little patience for this attitude toward people you’re trying to get into bed. Thank you, Marc, for following up on that by saying, basically, that generalizing isn’t a good idea. There’s also the idea that you get what you put out there, dude. Think about it.

I’m not finished listening yet, but wow. Just wow.

WTF: sometimes a struggle, always educational

Hester February 09, 2012 at 9:40 am

Scrabble (and verbal intelligence) _can_ be hot. I’d be curious to go out with Matt(hew) Graham. Hammer-Tag. What? Great. A Thaw. Hmm.

ziggy February 09, 2012 at 11:38 am

>>Scrabble (and verbal intelligence) _can_ be hot. -Theoretically, but you obviously haven’t watched Word Wars have you?

x February 09, 2012 at 3:57 pm

no one should judge matt who hasn’t gone through a similar experience.
matt, you’re doing good… in fact you’re doing much better than i am, so don’t listen to all the judgement.

Marv February 09, 2012 at 5:49 pm

Waaaaaah!  Poor guy, the world is against him.  Wah!

Reilly D February 09, 2012 at 9:48 pm

Pleasantly uplifted at the insightful observations, fairness and concern expressed by 98%
of fellow listeners- I was expecting the usual ignorant negative comments that are common
on the web (younger people mostly?).  Hope everyone reviews and considers all of the comments. 
My addition:
-When you listen a 2nd time, the interview is not as disturbing, and Mathew made subtle
clarifiers to his statements that can be missed at first listen (at least by me).
-Marc is quite familiar with some of the territory of dark thinking (and Mathew), and therefore may not have realized how deeply shocking the complete interview could be interpreted by some.
-Mc Donalds??? The last place Mathew, with a history of mental illness, and as a chemically affected/influenced/altered person, should be eating, is at a Mc Ds!!! 
As a person who faces mental illness issues, albeit not to such extremes, I am so much more rational than in earlier days, by incorporating a wellness regimen (strict diet, exercise, breathing/meditation, socialization, therapy) that works for me.  Chemical imbalances from a modern diet (along with emotional trauma and genetics) may have helped to start Matt’s
progression into illness.  Better nutrition can be a powerful step forward in treatment and growth.
-Most people with serious mental illness do not have the talent or intellect or achievements that Matt does.  So my sympathy for his struggles is tempered.

Mike February 09, 2012 at 11:34 pm

Where is his one-man show going to be?  I want to go!

Jessie February 10, 2012 at 1:30 am

People come on here complaining and parroting the same “you know” complaints thinking people really give a shit about their internet opinions, and they’re the sane ones?  Right.

Jessie February 10, 2012 at 1:58 am

I’d also like to say that I learned that Marc might be the only Jew who doesn’t like haggling.

trophymule February 10, 2012 at 2:42 am

It seems he’s torn between being either 1)the biggest loser or 2)the Son of God, reborn. Delusions of grandeur run both ways. Hence the addiction to Scrabble. When I think of the title “Scrabble World Champion” I think “Biggest Winner AND Biggest Loser.” Hey Matt, it’s a complicated world and we’re all struggling to make sense of it. I think it would do you good to exercise a little compassion for the rest of us. Here’s the challenge: next person you meet, take a little time to wonder (and ask!) about all the things happening in their life that have nothing to do with you. Might lead to some insights on coping.; definitely will lead to more friends. Good luck.

jimjim February 10, 2012 at 9:22 am

I agree with Reilly D, when you listen a 2nd time, the interview is not as disturbing. He definitely seems aware of the contradictions in his thinking and how he comes across.  Sounds like he has been working on it for a while now.

Mike, his one-man show is Feb 16 and Feb 17 at “The Kimball Studio”, 78 5th Ave.  NYC.  Wish I could go.

joshua-p February 10, 2012 at 9:24 am

I didn’t notice verbal ticks, but this interview was very hard for me to listen to, especially the second half. I didn’t like Matt from the start, but could kind of relate to him. But then he out-and-out lied about making a suicide attempt, and tried to pin it on Marc’s sensitive wording. Worst still was his blatant sexism. Whenever he spoke about women, I started to get queasy.

Usually I hear WTF interviews and feel like I like the subject more it’s over. Now I feel like avoiding Matt like the plague.

And if Matt is reading this, I’m sorry; but you’re kind of a complete tool.

Mike February 10, 2012 at 1:50 pm

Thanks jimjim, i heard the announcement on the next podcast with Bill Lawrence,
730 at the Kimball Studio on 2/16 and 2/17

im going-

adaM February 10, 2012 at 5:59 pm

this guy requires professional help in some capacity.  but on a more positive note, GREAT NEW GAME!!  go through the comments and try to figure out how many that crazy bastard wrote himself… it’s a real timesink

Susan February 10, 2012 at 7:02 pm

This interview moved me, as so many others have.  I am really soory about Ruth.

BigGuy February 10, 2012 at 7:28 pm

Marc asks questions that could receive a positive, cheerful response.  When Matt responds negatively, Marc replies with a comment or question that begs for a positive response, but none is forthcoming.  Marc fondly remembers his former room mate and their good times, albeit drunk and dissipated times, a generation ago.  Matt has transformed the good things in the past into negatives and made the bad things worse.

This is not an entertaining interview.  Its telling.  None of us would want to be unhappy and unproductive the way Matt appears to be.  He needs help.

Also, it’d be helpful for Marc’s guests to listen through a few of his other interviews before
hand.  I imagine that Matt does not want to come across to us the way he does here.

LAQ February 10, 2012 at 9:59 pm

This was brave and real.

Seamus February 10, 2012 at 11:23 pm

What a dick.

Art February 11, 2012 at 1:47 am

As long as Matt’s selling stuff, I would like to know if he still has the talking space heater and how much he wants for it. I’m willing to go $150 firm.

Jake February 11, 2012 at 5:10 am

I found Matt’s entire persona extremely unlikable. Poker players use a term called “running bad” to describe sometimes long periods of time where they are making the right moves and decisions but luck is against them and causes them to lose. Matt seems to think he has run bad his entire life. He whines about the okcupid rejections, he whines about not making the college basketball team when he’s 20 years older than his teammates. He will spend 10 minutes whining about not get a job at Conan, throw in a quick admission of his being consistently drunk on the job, then go back to whining some more. How many 39 year old men play on a college basketball team? None. How many men who’s online dating profile consists of naked pictures of themselves and confessions about how they can only relate to cats would you expect to be surrounded with women? None. one second he is calling himself a loser, but then the next he’s championing his basketball prowess, or his quiz team skills. I dont think he considers himself a loser, he just wants pity for “running bad” his entire life w/o taking much responsibility for where he’s at now. His misogynistic comments were disgusting. He hates women, obsesses about sex in a weirdly immature manner, and his plea for money at then end of the show was desperate and cringe worthy. He seemed like a guy who only wanted a fluff piece done for him and although he did agree to that much more revealing second half of the interview he was extremely bitter and confrontational with Marc about it. He sounds like a man who still needs help, professional help, even if he has remained successful in his sobriety. I hope he gets it

Brandt February 11, 2012 at 9:39 am

Interesting. Strange. Sad. Funny. Tragic. Honest. My synopsis. Some people unintentionally make shit hard on themselves.

Juan February 11, 2012 at 3:48 pm

Matt needed 15 minutes in a room with Patrice Oneal.  RIP Patrice.

RaeGina February 11, 2012 at 6:52 pm

The first interview was uncomfortable (as he donned the victim persona) yet Matt was funny and weird, which I’ve come to expect and enjoy from WTF． The second was beyond uncomfortable and I appreciate Matt’s perception and “truth” of his second interview.  It was a mutually beneficial exchange.  And I was warped enough to keep listening through the ‘you knows’ and self-cackling about trying to cut off his head.  What does that say about me?  I know Marc isn’t a doctor and he was helping out a friend but its obvious to this lay person that Matt could use some professional help.  Talk about attempted suicide by decapitation (wtf?!) and how the world owes him, even if he’s aware that its a “persecution complex”, is, in my opinion, crossing the line because he seemed so out of touch with reality.  So much so that Marc commented a few times how he didn’t want to provoke him. Is that why the reality checks were missing? ‘Cause Marc can sniff out BS and call people on it in a second.  I tune in for comedy and comedic insight.  This was like listening to a recorded psychiatric session in court after someone took their life (or the life of another) and the doctor didn’t do anything about it beforehand.  Oh, and if this is a put on, brilliant!  I hope it was.  Then I won’t feel whatever it is I feel now.  Marc, thanks for the awesome podcast.  Matt, I wish you peace and killer sets.

Raine February 12, 2012 at 4:45 am

wow.. the hardest thing for me about this entire episode was the absolute dark Cheapness of the $50 thing at the end .. What. The. F*ck. ??  I totally get that dude is needing cash (many of the people I currently know are there too) but to ...make a deal(??) like that on air seems only a little less worrisome than the sum of everything up to that point in the interview -aside from the neck cutting stuff- 

Oh and the thing about “all women being c*nts” reminds me of that Katt Williams bit (paraphrasing here) “if you find yourself talking about how “b*tches ain’t sh*t” then maybe you need to look at YOurself and figure out why you keep attracting ain’t-sh*t b*tches”

I totally get loving a cat super hardcore .. and needing any cash possible.. and having nude pictures of oneself .. but to air these things publicly without framing or awareness is disturbing as heck. 

Fascinating interview - though Far more abrasive than anything yet on WTF including Gallagher (by a long, long shot)

Willa February 12, 2012 at 8:31 am

Shaun and Art: thanks for the laughs!!!

itmustbebobby February 12, 2012 at 5:54 pm

One of my favorite interviews so far. I totally get this guy, and I can tell why Marc likes him so much. The people with such negative things to say about him need to open up their minds and allow something dark and unusual in once in a while.

Jenn February 12, 2012 at 8:46 pm

I would be really curious to see this guy’s stand up comedy.  In between the really disturbing parts I thought this guy had great delivery.  On the whole I thought he was pretty funny and I found him fascinating.  What came through to me was that Marc seemed to really like him.

I enjoyed this podcast a lot.  I hope that maybe he will be able to work out some of his shit by being back on stage again.  If nothing else it should give him a little human interation which he seems to realize he needs.

Nat February 12, 2012 at 10:05 pm

Marc, I hope you were doing this because you were worried about this guy. Otherwise, he is about as unlikeable as they come. He feels bad for himself aggressively and, in spite of being self-deprecating, manages to think he is entitled to everything he didn’t get. That part at the very end when he tried to get you to buy a board game was downright pathetic, though in some ways the only part that made me feel at all sympathetic for the guy.

Greg February 13, 2012 at 11:51 pm

This was a tough podcast to listen to but will probably stand out as one of my favorites.

I see a little bit of myself in Matt… with some bad luck, bad friends, bad drugs, and bad parents I could have ended up even more like him.  I really hope he can get through his shit.  Seems like he has a lot to offer if he can.

You know February 14, 2012 at 3:57 pm

You know.  I had to turn it off.  I could not hear him say “you know” one more time.
I don’t know what it is like to try to cut my head off and fail.

Mark February 14, 2012 at 6:46 pm

It wasn’t the “you knows” that drove me crazy, it was the “whatever’s” that we’re annoying.

Holy Shit February 14, 2012 at 6:56 pm

Holy shit!

10 minutes in, I don’t think I can handle 60 more minutes of this podcast.

You know?!

Holy Shit February 14, 2012 at 7:04 pm

god damn, listening to this guy is fucking brutal.

you know?

Mike February 15, 2012 at 2:13 pm

Hey…anyone know anything about his one man show…its not anywhere on the web including the website of Kimball Studios where it is supposed to be- I want to go but….is it actually on?

Christopher_from_Texas February 17, 2012 at 6:56 pm

I really did enjoy this episode.  Even if it was a bit hard to listen to.  Marc wasn’t using or profiting off of Graham.  He was talking to an old friend with problems that he needed to air.

Lifelong depression is not a fun thing to go through, and I feel your pain, Matt.  I really hope you find some kind of peace in the future.

George February 22, 2012 at 8:31 am

“Insane and eccentric people bless the earth” This episode was hilarious, frightening, discomfiting, annoying, unsettling,  infuriating, profound, heartbreaking, but most of all totally engrossing and a great solace for anyone who has ever sabotaged himself with a powerful but misguided brain. It’s a supreme act of mercy to let other people (like me) know that they aren’t the only ones whose minds turn against them in strange ways. I strive to believe God will bless the both of you guys for that.  For me, only Jonathan Winters topped this episode and I listen religiously to this podcast. Marc you’re an indispensable sensationalist, thank God for you, and Matt, you’re the best kind of whore, a pure whore if ever there was one. You’re part of some sort of Irish drunk fuckup wordsmith tradition I’m not smart enough to identify but I know exists.  This episode lifted me from a real funk, and for that I can only say THANK YOU.

Matt February 22, 2012 at 8:01 pm

Although harshly put, I agree with Simon’s opinion. Graham sounds like someone who displaces blame in order to survive and make sense of what he sees as his (mostly) unsatisfactory life. He constantly brings up destiny, fate, and makes sweeping generalizations in order to support his misguided opinions. My favorite was that all women are apparently ‘soul-sucking cunts’(paraphrasing here) because he has been rejected innumerable times. Right.

I think he uses God as a scape goat to place blame on in order to not hold himself responsible for his own actions. Before it was alcohol and drugs, now it’s religion and some ridiculous sense of being cursed with bad luck, instead of his own aggressively anti-social tendencies, which are clearly evident in the second half of this interview. He’s so passive aggressive in his attitude towards Marcs apparent lack of gumption in directly addressing his suicide attempt that it’d be funny if it weren’t so frustrating.

He claims that he is simply being ‘honest’, but as Marc tried to say in the interview, there is such a thing as selective honesty. It’s not a matter of what he’s saying, it’s that he says it all at once, and it’s simply overwhelming for most people, which is reasonable. But the conclusion that Graham makes from this is that “all people are full of shit, and I’m not” (that ones essentially a direct quote). And of course, all women are out to make men debase themselves for their own sick pleasure. Ridiculous.

His sobriety is certainly a step in the right direction, but he’s only trading one vice for another. The first (alcoholism) was material, this one’s ideological. He uses both as a way to make himself out to be persecuted by a world that is out to get him. While he may no longer be having hallucinations, he is delusional. Graham clearly still has a long ways to go, and needs some mental help.

Wesley February 23, 2012 at 3:19 am

If I were Marc I wouldn’t want fans like some of you.

This was journalism as it once was and has always meant to be - illuminating, and not everyone nor everything looks the same in the light.

Truly hope Matt wants to find the help he needs.

Troumloura February 23, 2012 at 4:04 am

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barny drood February 26, 2012 at 12:53 pm

“not sober, but responsible”...a line destined to endless recitative rantings, at A.A. metgs, in your neighborhood, sometime soon.  as in,this is not the way we do biz here, kiddies and gents.  matt graham,is a genius,after all…..

Daisy February 26, 2012 at 4:12 pm

I think that’s what A.A. people call a dry drunk. Sober but not responsible for his own actions or anything approaching acceptance or comfort in his own skin. He has a ways to go in getting to the better, more peaceful parts of being in recovery. But hey, it’s still possible.

He’s absolutely right about one thing: he definitely needs someone to talk to.

Matt March 04, 2012 at 3:31 pm

The best part was when Matt sold Marc the Vegas board game for $50

Daniel March 15, 2012 at 10:55 am

Anyone who listens to this and doesn’t outright see that this is a man struggling with mental health issues is probably an asshole. It never ceases to amaze me how people love to shit on just about anyone to feel superior and better about themselves. Matt sounds like a thousand other insanely talented people that are off center probably for the same reasons that they are so good at what they do and my heart goes out to him. Some of you people are just awful.

Rachel March 16, 2012 at 12:41 am

Wow, you guys are calling Matt grandiose? How about you all? Apparently you all are psychiatrists?

I actually am a mental health professional and here is my expert opinion: you can’t diagnose someone based on a freaking podcast. Ridiculous.

Sure, it sounded as Matt has a history of mental health issues, but I don’t see where some of you are feel that you are able to ascertain the level of his current impairment, or know the inner workings of his mind.

Personally, this was one of my favorite WTFs ever. I found Matt funny, eccentric, disarmingly honest—all the same things that I love about listening to Marc, come to think of it. I am also really inspired by his effort to reenter comedy and wish him the best.

Rachel March 16, 2012 at 12:42 am

Blah, typos. I guess that’s what you get for making comments when you are both sleep deprived and pissed off. Apologies!

Parge April 05, 2012 at 10:44 am

Quasi bulimic ethyl optimization plan: this will be the name of my next band. Geniuses makin’ chunder sound sexy.

Haley April 22, 2012 at 5:12 am

Man, no matter the state of his mental health, I loved that “Fenway park-Australia type of suicide” thing he threw out there. That was fucking hilarious, haha.

?!?!?!?! May 02, 2012 at 6:03 am

How did Marc not throw up when he talked about his suicide attempt? Was he in shock? Did he already have the information? This has scared me straight and I wasn’t even bent. Holy shit dude. Holy fucking shit.

Brendon David May 09, 2012 at 10:10 am

Great episode.  Wow.  Good for you, Marc, for not allowing Matt Graham to draw you into the pit.  When he becomes combative or how he calls it “honest” or “defame your character to your face” he has to do that as a tactic…even if he doesn’t consciously think about it each time.  People that act like that bank on the fact that the response of the other person is X.  Good for you for breaking his pattern.  I like how you kept your cool when he got a bit emotional.

BTW, you missed the opportunity to bust his balls.  He wanted to you to pay him for his story.  It was lame that he tried to push the board game and it’s great old school value.  That was a lame/hypocritical angle he took.

At any rate, great show.  I’m glad I listened to it.  Matt is a funny guy.

Anthony Zapata May 14, 2012 at 2:42 pm

WTF are all these well adjusted commenters doing listening to Marc f*cking Maron? I’m clearly in the wrong comment section.

Leonard Pitchfork May 15, 2012 at 11:08 am

Once again, the community of negative comments continues to be disappointing and boring.  I was looking through the episodes, curiously seeing which have the most comments.  This one appears to be it and is just full of whining and assuming they know how Marc’s brain works.